Maybe I should start with a very basic expandable system

[sofasurfer]

Since my main goal is not nessessarily to save money on electricity, although that would be nice, but to have a fairly normal life when the economy collapses, I have been thinking about the most logical way for me to go. I would like to be free of the grid but theres no way I can afford a lot right now, and being grid tied would mostly just serve to increase my costs to get started.

My idea is to plan a very basic system that is expandable from nearly nothing up to running the whole house. I am thinking that I would start by buying an inverter large enough that I would not need to replace it later, a controller with the same trait, one panel and a battery or two. I would start by powering the lights in my pole barn and then grow as I learn, powering my saws and such. When I get enough I would then connect to the house.

Does this sound like a good way to start?

[BB.]

It is a tough way to go--Starting small and growing over time... In general, I would suggest that you can "up size" a system by about a factor of 2x before you have consider virtually starting from scratch. Plus, some components (like solar panels) are only available for a few years then the next "bigger, cheaper, better" panels come along--And many times, you cannot add them onto the same MPPT charge controller because of Imp/Vmp mis-matches (or the original panels cost 2x what the current panels would cost).

So, you could start with something small like this:

Add this link to our Solar Beginner Post:

Emergency Power

Basically a very long thread that starts from the beginning with a few vague requirements through design and assembly for a "portable" solar RE off-grid power box.

And here is another example by Mike90045 called the Solar Monolith:





Update pictures/information here.

-Bill

Then--I would go along these lines (assuming you have local blackouts from storms that only last a week or two worst case):

1. Conservation: Not matter what you do later--Understand your loads, reduce power usage (insulation, Energy Star Appliances, Laptop vs Desktop computers, etc...). You will save money on your Grid Power, and a whole lot more on your emergency/backup power.
2. Figure out Battery AH/Voltage to support a minimal set of loads (frdige, lights, radio, computer+sat--Etc.)
3. Buy a Battery Bank that meets your above needs (probably start with an inexpensive set of flooded cell batteries--your "training bank").
4. Buy an Inverter/Charger or Inverter+AC battery charger
5. Buy a Genset that supports above AC Charger + battery bank (too big, drinks fuel; too small, may not meet your needs). I like the Honda eu2000i ~1,600 watt family. Quiet and efficient with smaller loads.
6. Buy a Charge Controller + some solar panels
7. Buy more solar panels (as finances allow)

Before you buy the first thing... Run through all of the above calculations (size your battery bank and voltage, size your inverter/charger, size your genset, etc.).

Personally, unless you have some very specific needs (like 1 month of backup power in summer with A/C, well pump, etc.)--I like to go small with power needs. A Honda eu2000i genset will run from 4 hours to ~9+ hours on 1.1 gallon tank of fuel. It is much easier to store/recycle 2 gallons of fuel per day for 10 days (say 20 gallons) than to run a genset that will drink 0.5-1.0+ gallons per hour (the typical 7.5-10kW home backup generators).

Also, fuel type (propane, diesel, natural gas, gasoline), storage and if available in an emergency (natural gas in an earthquake--My SHTF situation).

You may end up with several sized/costed paper designs. Play with those first (and ask questions/make plans) based on which one you will/can implement.

Long term--Batteries last 5-10 years or so, inverters/charge controllers 10 years or so, etc... And stuff breaks.

Here, because of earthquakes (and possibly other areas with hurricanes/etc.)--I am not sure I would want to spend a whole bunch money in a fixed installation if it was in a metropolitan area. If the home/cabin/farm is out in the middle of no-where--Then it may make sense to build the independent homestead.

For heating--Look at Solar Thermal (even places with snow on the ground can use solar heating). And look at solar stoves/ovens for cooking (if you do not have a supply of wood in your area/farm.

Solar Shed and other Solar Thermal Links
www.sunoven.com (just for information--don't know anything about them)

Note that solar thermal does lend itself very nicely to Do It Yourself type projects (home made collectors, thermal storage tanks, plumbing, etc.). But they do require service (leaks, air locks, pump problems, etc.).

-Bill

[waynefromnscanada]

What you are thinking of is the way I went, starting very small, thinking of only running a radio and a light or two during power outages etc. This grew to the point where, to my astonishment, I'm living off grid, which had been beyond my wildest dreams in those earlier days. BUT - - it ended up being an expensive way to go, replacing perfectly good controllers, inverters etc as the system grew. And now I find myself painted into a corner, financially locked into a 12 volt system, which because of it's present size, should be 24 volts. The end cost, not even thinking of switching to 24 volts, has been far more than if I had started out with only what I have now.
On the other hand, if I had been presented with the price of the correct system from the start, I would have turned my back and walked away. Instead, doing it the wrong way, bit by bit, has in my case, allowed me to be where I now am, living off grid. Oh, and a word of warning - - dipping your toes into the world of solar energy can result in a serious addiction to said solar energy

[westbranch]

Another way of looking at Wayne's approach is it allows you to kill smaller, cheaper batteries rather than a larger more expensive one...